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GreenSprite — charcoal sketches
Published: 2010-09-24 14:10:18 +0000 UTC; Views: 2402; Favourites: 18; Downloads: 83
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I don't use charcoal a lot, but I got inspired a while ago and made these. Submitting for diversity's sake (and more horses).I have mixed feelings about my heavily referenced works. On one hand, they are better and people like them. On the other hand, it feels like cheating on some level (though it is the only way to learn). I'm always more fond of work I do without reference.
Stock credit: ~Megan1970 , ~GothicDark-Stock , =larfsalot ( [link] [link] [link] )
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Comments: 38
I've got the same feelings about references <.< But oh well, one's gotta learn somehow
I really like the shading and facture, the bottom most horse looks so soft and sweet it makes me wanna hug him ^^
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Hug him! Horses really are very soft!!
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xD I always wanted to do that, but were and still am a bit afraid (I mean horses I saw were sooooo big, and often mean -.- and I'm not very fond on geting bitten by one 
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Well, you have to ask if it's ok to pet them, and stay away if they look nervous. I rarely get to be around horses, but when I do, I pet them because they're SO awesome. I never got bitten or anything so far
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I know, but still... They're bigger than me xD
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I love that horse on the top.
I feel like using reference gives you a feel for things so that you don't have to use it later on. Kind of like drawing from life helps you draw from imagination, you know?
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Thank you!
I'm definitely not saying that reference is bad or useless. It has plenty of advantages, I was just wondering why do I generally feel less emotionally connected to my referenced works.
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Well, cuz it's not all you, innit? It's like, might as well just use the photograph.
For me, anyhow.
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Well, arguments both for and against references. XD I don't feel strongly either way.
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Great sketches - I love charcoal, it's so easy to blend and you can get it really dark and dramatic, playing with light and shadows. The horse in the top left looks really dynamic.
I wouldn't feel guilty about using references for the drawings. Everybody needs a guide to help with certain postures, figures, movement etc. That's why the stock-artists are out there - for which I'm eternally grateful!
In all honesty, there's not much difference between drawing a face from a photo someone else has taken, to drawing an actual face that's right in front of you. It's all taken from reference. The only exception would be if the photo you looked at was submitted as a work of art in itself - in which case drawing from it should simply BE for practice purposes, otherwise it's a rip-off - or if it was put into the world for the exact purpose of being an aid to artists - in which case, acknowledging where the pose/object came from is common courtesy, but you can turn it into your own work, in your own style.
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I am grateful for stock artists as well - there's just this thing: I can't give credit most of the time, unless I post my drawing on a site that allows comments under it (like deviant art). I wish there was more stock that can be used without crediting - not because I'm lazy or disrespectful to stock artists, it just isn't always possible. That means I can't use reference when I most need it :/ It's so frustrating to find the perfect pose in a picture and not be able to copy it.
Ah well, the world is not perfect and such.
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Ah. Well, I don't post anywhere on the internet apart from here (and my Portfolio page, but that's joined with DA anyway). So I've never come across the problem personally, but I can see what you mean. Though there are still a lot of stock artists who say their work is free to use, and not just on this site. They don't even mind if you credit them or not (though I always do) just that you let THEM know you've used it. But as you say, not ALL stock artists are so generous - and it's normally the really good poses that you really want that aren't available at all! Sigh.
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Nice sketches/studies 
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Using references is very important for the work you plan on doing without reference. I went a long while without using references, and my non-referenced work suffered eventually. If you're anything like me (and maybe you're not), it's possible to forget or miss some important details when it comes to lighting, shadows or anatomy itself. It makes the non-referenced work look less real, which can cause a viewer to feel detached from it. Unless you plan on developing your own style and you're not concerned with how real something looks, I guess references aren't so important.
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You made an interesting point there. I was all focused on how I feel detached from my referenced work, that I didn't even think that the same can happen for the viewers (except with non-referenced work). And I definitely think you're right, because I can often tell a referenced drawing when I see it. If done right, it beats imagination alone.
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I often find it surprising just how much I forget when I keep drawing from the imagination alone. We artists definitely need lots and lots of practice drawing from models and references. I always find my things to look very stylized and comic-like when I try to do my own thing. I forget how good my work can be if only I use reality to draw from every now and then.
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hard work pays, gurl!
vad ca ti-au iesit foarte bine, si foarte bine ai facut sa folosesti poze de referinta; singura problema cu pozele e ca nu iti dai seama de volum asa de bine ca in realitate, dar daca stii volumele, atunci poza te ajuta doar sa nu gresesti (zic io)
o mica observatie la nasul fetei: parca e vazut din profil in loc sa fie semiprofil. este acolo o dunga mai inchisa care trea mai la stanga sau ceva de genu, vezi tu
calutu asta de jos i preferatu meu pt ca are obrajori, si ochisori, botu negru si pete pe gat (/me pets)
calutu de sus are lumina foarte buna pe el, ceea ce nu rezulta din poza de referinta care nu prea arata volumul animalului; in alte cuvinte: nu poti sa zici ca poza are rol principal, eventual pt contur, deci tu ai facut singura ce era mai important
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Da, recunosc ca inca nu stiu face bine nasurile (mai ales la femei). Obrajori de cal ftw.
Nu stiu cum sa-mi dau seama de volume 
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recomandarea de astazi, duminica december 12, 1.56 pm:
Incearca modelajul for once!*
_________________________________
*cea mai sigura cale sa iti dai seama de volume, best ever, testata clinic
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Am incercat for once, in generala. Da nu mai tin minte daca o ajutat la ceva 
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The forum folk made me feel really bad about using reference last time I spoke to them. They were all like "Why can't you just go outside and use real stuff as models? 
Either way, the sheer idiocy of the people who say that using refs is cheating is enough to convince me that the only problem with using refs is those people. Besides, works made without refs tend to look abstracto-crappy and nobody likes that.
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So more than half of my gallery looks abstracto-crappy, good to know
My problem is not with what other people say, but with how I feel about reference. On some level I'm worried that I'll *never* be able to make a good painting without some sort of model in front of me. That scares me.
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That's silly. You'll reach a point one day when you will have learned so much from reference images that you'll be able to deduct how stuff is supposed to look, so don't worry.
As for abstracto-crappy, I'm not saying that your gallery is that way. It's just that I got a bit burned because of such things. But more about that in a couple of days.
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Will we be blessed with an eye-opening journal of revelation?
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Thank you for letting us use it
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I think that these look great. Charcoal can be really tricky to work with...what sort of paper did you use?
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Regular printer paper (recycled again, you can see some writing on the back if you look hard)
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Ah right, do you find it easier to work with charcoal on smooth like that?
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I'm not sure, I never even tried using charcoal on quality paper. There was always a better use for it.
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I've used it on cartridge paper, which can create some interesting affects...
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